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    sonicbomb.com :: View topic - All for the sake of his maniacal ego

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    Graviton
    Yankee (13.5 mt)


    Joined: Sep 03, 2006
    Posts: 1549
    Location: USA

    PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:33 pm Reply with quote

    Of course Chavez started this fighting by disrespecting Spain's former president Aznar as a "fascist."

    Even Aznar's succeeding Spanish political rivals, including Zapatero, a socialist, also denied Aznar being a fascist.

    Oh no! It came down to Chavez thinking he was then disrespected, so one-sided, ignoring his own aggressive, rude, undiplomatic remarks, after he started it all with disrespectful, unfounded allegations.

    Now it's Venezuelan cronies of Chavez putting investments hostage to the maniacal ego of Chavez.

    It's hallmark of dictators like Chavez to punish those who oppose his ideas or power through widespread, aggressive government action. Chavez is also accused of arming the gunmen who shot protesters rallying against Chavez's dictatorship.

    -----------

    Chavez Demands Spanish King Juan Carlos Apologize for Verbal Slap, Hints Investments Could Be at Risk

    Wednesday, November 14, 2007

    CARACAS, Venezuela
    President Hugo Chavez is not about to turn the other cheek after a catching a verbal slap from Spanish King Juan Carlos last weekend.

    The fiery leftist leader of Venezuela all but openly warned Spain that his country doesn't need Spanish investment, and that he expects the king to offer an immediate apology.

    "The king lost it," Chavez said at a political rally late Tuesday night. "He should say, '... I, the king, confess, I was beside myself, I made a mistake.' "

    The international incident took place last Saturday at a political summit in Chile, during which time the king interrupted a Chavez name-calling rant by leaning across the conference table and yelling, "Why don't you just shut up?"

    Chavez again spoke about the incident during a news conference Wednesday, repeating his demand for an apology, while offering a veiled threat of retribution.

    "He disrespected me, and he was laid bare before the world in his arrogance and also his impotence," Chavez told reporters. "We don't want this to become a political crisis."

    "Spain has many investments, private companies here and we don't want to damage that, but if they are damaged, they are damaged. Spanish investment in Venezuela is not indispensable. ... We don't need it," Chavez said, mentioning Spanish banks Banco Santander SA and Banco Bilbao Vizcaya Argentaria SA.

    "Whatever has been privatized can be taken back, we can take it back," Chavez told Reuters. "If the government of Spain or the state of Spain ... start to generate a conflict, things are not going to go well."

    The spat began Saturday when Chavez accused former Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar of backing a coup that briefly removed him from power in 2002 and repeatedly called Aznar "fascist" in an address at the summit of leaders from Latin America, Spain and Portugal.

    Spain's current socialist prime minister, Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, asked Chavez to be more diplomatic. When Chavez kept talking, Juan Carlos leaned into view and said, "Why don't you shut up?"

    Recounting Spain's history of colonial rule in Latin America, Chavez called the King's remark a reflection of "500 years of arrogance."

    "'Why don't you shut up?' It's the same imperial fury, imperial arrogance," Chavez said.

    Spain diplomats worked feverishly behind the scenes, trying to ease tensions between the two leaders.

    "We are fully convinced that due to action being taken on all sides it will be possible in a relatively ... short time, to return ties to normal," Foreign Minister Miguel Angel Moratinos told Reuters.
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    fastfission
    Cherokee (3.8 mt)


    Joined: Apr 14, 2007
    Posts: 425
    Location: Arzamas-16

    PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:32 am Reply with quote

    Fancy threatening Spanish companies because of a personal beef with a purely titular head of state. Chavez has sure got an ego issue. Perhaps too much of Latin America's greatest export has been disappearing up his nose..... Laughing

    FF
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    Graviton
    Yankee (13.5 mt)


    Joined: Sep 03, 2006
    Posts: 1549
    Location: USA

    PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:24 am Reply with quote

    Actually the king of Spain has a very important role in the restive peninsula. He is a figure of unity in a very culturally and politically divided Spain.

    As examples, Andalusia considers itself the most conservative example of Spanish culture, from where we see the traditional Spanish cowboy culture and the invention of the siesta meal- and naptime. Bascos are fiercely independent, and also have their own language, beyond large dialectical differences between regions. Because of their violent independence moves, former dictator Franco tried to wipe out their culture and independent attitude by banning Basco language and their unique traditions.

    Not important??

    Quote:
    According to a poll by "Sigma Dos" published in the newspaper El Mundo in November 2005, 77.5% of Spaniards thought Juan Carlos was "good or very good", 15.4% "not so good", and only 7.1% "bad or very bad". Even so, the issue of the monarchy re-emerged on 28 September 2007 as photos of the King were burnt in public in Catalonia by relatively small groups of protesters wanting the restoration of the Republic. SRC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_Carlos_I_of_Spain
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    fastfission
    Cherokee (3.8 mt)


    Joined: Apr 14, 2007
    Posts: 425
    Location: Arzamas-16

    PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:01 pm Reply with quote

    Again you spin and spin my posts to interpret them other than what they actually say. Where did I say "not important"? Nowhere. Your words not mine. Can you not read or are you so caught up in your own bombast and pomposity that you are blind to actual the words on the page?

    Juan Carlos as King is a titular head of state. The role is purely titular with no executive power, just as all the European monarchies are. Fact. I did not say the role was "not important" or that Juan Carlos does not play a useful role. See eg

    http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CE1D91E3FF936A35753C1A967958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all

    for commentary on his popularity and the topics on which he is outspoken.

    Read before rant.


    FF
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    Graviton
    Yankee (13.5 mt)


    Joined: Sep 03, 2006
    Posts: 1549
    Location: USA

    PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 5:34 pm Reply with quote

    Quote:
    ... Purely titular head of state.


    This likely implies that he has no importance in Spanish politics to many people reading this thread.

    I was countering this notion, not you, FF. I was clarifying to others that there is an important and not hollow role for the king of Spain, beyond his title role as also symbolic Commander in Chief of the armed forces of Spain.

    It was not a rant on my part. Laughing
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    Grog
    Fizzle
    Fizzle


    Joined: Jan 01, 2008
    Posts: 5

    PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:50 am Reply with quote

    I spent a year in Caracas following the purchase of our CF-116 (F-5) aircraft, to audit the transition. I became confident that Spain's influence was becoming negligible.
    That said, there are a number of proletariats that see sector governance by diplomatic representation as an ECONOMICAL benefactor to current problems.
    The scenario at present has identified the extent to which the current government has proposed unilateral fascism.
    Sorry, but it's true.
    Hopefully it will burn out in a year or two. Most importantly, I encourage foreign governments to LET it burn out or Chavez will use foreign intervention (again) to rally support.
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    Graviton
    Yankee (13.5 mt)


    Joined: Sep 03, 2006
    Posts: 1549
    Location: USA

    PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 5:43 am Reply with quote

    Grog wrote:

    That said, there are a number of proletariats that see sector governance by diplomatic representation as an ECONOMICAL benefactor to current problems.
    The scenario at present has identified the extent to which the current government has proposed unilateral fascism.
    Sorry, but it's true.
    Hopefully it will burn out in a year or two. Most importantly, I encourage foreign governments to LET it burn out or Chavez will use foreign intervention (again) to rally support.


    It isn't fascism in Venezuela.

    Fascism is a highly nationalistic system, not an internationalist movement like Chavez is trying to infect throughout his neighboring region.

    Chavez' aim is to provide support among a new political robber baron elite that socialism creates, using polemics appealing to the lower classes and his nouveau riche cronies in autocratic crime in seizing power and driving to rule by decree.

    Fascism appeals to the middle and upper classes, despite limited ownership of some key industries allied with the military.

    In Venezuela it's autocratic socialism only serving Chavez and his cronies. He is using oil wealth to buy his way into a permanent dictatorship, and only for that reason.
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